New Hive Spam Network

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(Edited)

Yesterday a new spam network was started, I have my suspicions on who it maybe and digging through some log files to confirm.

They have been creating accounts that look like existing users and setting their metadata to look like the original user. They then steal posts from that user and repost them. If you follow new, it may be difficult to detect these posts at a casual glance unless you goto their profile directly and do some research.

Some of them have even received large votes from to the tune of around $15. No worries though, these rewards will all be removed before payout.

I have identified over 300 accounts in this network and have have been additional ones created that haven't activated yet. It appears this will be an ongoing problem as they attempt to attack Hive in various ways.

If you notice your post has been stolen, it is most likely one of these new accounts.

If you follow created a lot, double check you are voting on the original author and not one of these fraudulent clones.

Example Posts w/ Payouts

Post PayoutURL
0.1560https://peakd.com/@bee1in/e-yakun-moaku
0.3670https://peakd.com/@aster0ids/the-asteroid-files-5-or-resource-scarcity-and-opportunity-costs
0.2170https://peakd.com/@big-power/5000-sp-finally-he-calls-me-at-home
0.0830https://peakd.com/@cyg0n/setting-up-my-first-miner-and-other-weekend-fun
0.8680https://peakd.com/@greckibazarewy/moj-maly-zwierzyniec
6.8430https://peakd.com/@felix-garciap/golden-censer-s-message-april-02-2020-matthew-6-21
13.2990https://peakd.com/@iamjade1ine/enhancing-fine-motor-skills-homeschooling
0.4360https://peakd.com/@itchyfeetd0nica/ntopaz--itchyfeetdonica--1201129601--ntopaz--2019-10-08-00-59-07--artwork--none
0.1590https://peakd.com/@mari11aanne/haiku-contest-6-old-friends
0.8860https://peakd.com/@kibe1a/window-to-the-night-sky
4.2370https://peakd.com/@mi1aan/quora-onboarding-initiative-q-how-do-i-check-the-exact-timing-of-my-upvote-in-a-post-and-the-probable-curation-reward-in-steem
0.4310https://peakd.com/@kibe1a/spring-flower
0.3050https://peakd.com/@moe-knows/good-morning-from-hospital
0.2890https://peakd.com/@truel0vem0m/a-night-walk-on-wednesday
5.3610https://peakd.com/@light-photo/lightpainting-mandalas-04
0.3480https://peakd.com/@m0l0velly/34ba82a8966fb03cbb94bdf5fef5694a-vimmtv
0.4980https://peakd.com/@z0bayer/colorchallenge-monday-red-wedding-reception-stage

Current list (more being added as we speak)

  • a1amin33
  • a1ebrijes
  • aaron-731
  • abcor-spt
  • abh12345-sports
  • abhl2345
  • achimo3
  • acu-fund
  • ad0nisr
  • ag-moore
  • akipp0nn
  • alex-absolute
  • alyssa-mey
  • amah0vac93
  • amygoodrich
  • an0123
  • andy1ein
  • anroja-sports
  • appicsgir1
  • appreciat0r
  • ap-teacher
  • arslannasir9o9o
  • art-galleryraka
  • asdo9
  • aster0ids
  • ata1gyi
  • aur0divys
  • ave1692
  • b0bskib0b
  • b0tante
  • bdvoter-cur
  • be1eg
  • beakd
  • bee1in
  • be-helen
  • berge1mirsenpai
  • bestb00m
  • bigm
  • big-power
  • bobby-madagascar
  • br0sin0
  • br0xi
  • brucutul
  • bryanimhoff
  • bubub00mt
  • c00ltivar
  • c0redump
  • cameron-barnes
  • cannapals
  • canna-writer
  • cari0ca
  • ch00girl
  • cheese-4ead
  • chinese-bi
  • chops-support
  • circle-point
  • cliff-agreen
  • c-malescov
  • cmmofficial
  • cmp1xty
  • coderbts
  • cool-buddy
  • coqui-unlimited
  • crypt0s17
  • crypt0vues
  • crypto-story
  • cryp-toxicate
  • cu1gin
  • cur-angel
  • cyg0n
  • d0wnv0teme
  • dalz-photo
  • dam1a
  • dani1e666
  • dan-status
  • da-planet
  • deral23
  • derwin-augustus
  • drill-ith
  • drl0bes
  • drone-graphica
  • dude0ntheweb
  • durbisr0driguez
  • e1eidap
  • eliezer-floyd
  • elmund0dexa0
  • el-nathan
  • em0n366
  • en-grave
  • ericboucher
  • erikkl0k
  • ervinlemark
  • esech0l0
  • et-handsmith
  • evildid0
  • exy1e
  • f1atman
  • f1emingfarm
  • fcb-spt
  • felix-garciap
  • fengcha0
  • fish1ucy
  • fitzgibb0n
  • fl0rin0
  • flam0
  • flow-cannon
  • fluff-cloud
  • foresterjoe
  • f-turner19
  • fun2-learn
  • furi0sl0si
  • futi1e
  • games-joyce
  • gandalfthedark
  • gear-nsnow
  • glory-7
  • greckibazarewy
  • green-do
  • h0w0
  • h1aingwin
  • hafizu11ah
  • hamsa-quality
  • her0s
  • hettyrowan
  • hispapr0
  • huaren-news
  • hyborianstrain
  • i0i0i0i0i
  • iamjade1ine
  • iamnot-social
  • ico-reviewblog
  • ifart-rainbows
  • im-charming
  • invest-egg
  • invest-prosper
  • isariaccc
  • isariaphoto
  • isiahwa1t
  • itchyfeetd0nica
  • jazzher0
  • jerry-tsuseer
  • jersteemit-sport
  • jgr33nw00d
  • ji11feint
  • jinizzang
  • joeyfancy
  • joeytech-talks
  • k0nl0n
  • kasiarepl985
  • ketc0m4real
  • keyp1ex
  • kibe1a
  • kimi1i
  • kita1ee
  • kl0ne
  • krazyp0et
  • kristyg1as
  • kryl0vayar
  • krypto-formator
  • l0ngye
  • l0rdg0d
  • l0tear
  • laser-city
  • laych0
  • leslie-revales
  • less-horrible
  • librepensad0ra
  • light-photo
  • little-gremlin
  • lrc-consult
  • m0el0ut
  • m0l0velly
  • m0wemu
  • maarni0
  • majes-tytyty
  • mana-bank
  • mang0s
  • marble-ly
  • marble-sz
  • mari11aanne
  • maria-msinn
  • measure-able
  • melissa-official
  • men0
  • mi1aan
  • mighty-panda
  • mksportstoken
  • modern-zorker
  • moe-knows
  • monster-mama
  • monstersralph
  • mount-aingod
  • mrsb0zz
  • mummamonza
  • music-mip
  • my0khant
  • n00pu
  • na1exadre
  • neddy-kelly
  • neutral-izer
  • nocompass-norway
  • nyan1ynnhtay
  • o1ddemon
  • ocb-witness
  • oscar-oef
  • p0c0t0
  • pa-trickulrich
  • pedr0brit02004
  • pedr0canella
  • penpa1s
  • perfi1brasi1
  • phe1imint
  • philip-pekiene
  • plad0zer0
  • pocket-js
  • post-promoter
  • project007-ccc
  • project-hope
  • qu0chuy
  • r0mbtc
  • rafar0sad0
  • raisemeup
  • raise-up
  • random-voter
  • raven-mottram
  • rayshiu-images
  • rea1treebivvy
  • rebe-torres12
  • retin0x
  • re-verseacid
  • ritikd0kania23
  • roelanpd
  • rondon
  • rooms-ervice
  • s0lairitas
  • s0ushi888
  • sandra-carrascal
  • sat0rid
  • sbi1o
  • sch1ees
  • sfrtreasury
  • sh0utl0ud
  • shim0zurd0
  • shine-dojo
  • siggib0y81
  • silvi0mangum29
  • sm0lalit
  • sm0nbear
  • sm0nian
  • solar-warrior
  • s-omegaming
  • someguy456
  • sp1iddash
  • st0jay007
  • steem-consultant
  • steemedproxy
  • steem-historian
  • steem-itasclub
  • steemitralph
  • steem-london
  • steem-power4
  • steem-telly
  • steem-ulant
  • steve-jhuggett
  • sweet-kathy
  • syedshaki1
  • t0ric0
  • taga1
  • tattoo-djay
  • team-australia
  • the-marky-mark
  • the-real-wolf
  • there-alyme
  • tomato-m
  • tr0nhill
  • trev0rpetrie
  • tript0lemus
  • truel0vem0m
  • truth-bot
  • tyedyefire-power
  • upmewhale-team
  • ur-trailer
  • v0ter000
  • vaughndem0nt
  • vincent-nijman
  • v-lemon
  • wendy-th16
  • william-turner
  • x60c5
  • xanders1ee
  • xt0phercruzeu
  • y0mism0s0y
  • yabapmat
  • your-averageguy
  • z0bayer
  • zeleirac-ordero


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157 comments
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What's very interesting is your 8888 witnesses are stealing someone's Steem, not who the account belongs to.

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Well, if that someone claims to be new to Steem, when he might be the alt of some longterm bigshot.. it is indeed.

Transparency should be treated high, especially here :)

No excuse for the 8888 Softfork though..
Except that it is the best thing that could happen for Hive. Making it clear that things are going South for Steem.

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Hive is subject to the exact issues Steem is suffering. The only difference is that Hive is currently administered by a cabal of whales that don't want to do such stupid things with their stake.

That could change at any moment. Hive is no more secure than Steem. It's literally just Steem with the founder's stake stuffed into the HPS instead of sold to Sun Yuchen.

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Justin also keeps on talking to Justin irrespective of whether he's on drugs or not. If you try to analyse, you'll crash on the roof of Tron Foundation. Focus on 'sanctity of private property' dude.

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Someone has few accounts - very interesting indeed!

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Well, if that someone claims to be new to Steem, when he might be the alt of some longterm bigshot.. it is indeed.

Transparency should be treated high, especially here :)

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So we can freeze user account if he's not telling truth. Good to know!

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Nope, never said that.

Imo these are 2 different stories; both should be investigated (well, 8888 is rather clear) and criticised.

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Having multiple accounts is definitely not an issue by itself. But Blocktrades created sock puppet accounts in order to take control of the Steem blockchain in a more malicious way than Justin Sun. He introduced Darthknight as a new account and fooled all of us.

image.png

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Source
Spamming comments is frowned upon by the community. Continued comment spamming may result in the account being Blacklisted.

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Thanks Mark. I know I never say that enough, but I really do appreciate all the 'toil and trouble' you go through for the chain and the community.

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for fun I tried if math0wl was created but alas I am not that famous

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I just realized your name is Math Owl (I think).

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I'm still trying to piece together why I was highlighted lol I'm not a big account or anything..

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Damn, that is one hell of a list! You did some thorough homework

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(Edited)

Could you create an api with a list of users to flag? Or maybe we have something like this already?

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I have considered exposing some toolings, as it is usually just me I haven't needed to, but I have thought about it in the past.

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(Edited)

I will use this list but an auto-updated api would be cool :)

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(Edited)

Great job as always. Hope theyre all going on your global blacklist as it's then easy to see if they have a read number against their name!!

Seems I'm not famous enough either lol....but wait.....@project007-ccc is a copy of my curation account @project007.ccc ......all of 2SP and 20K in Creative coin tokens....I'm in with the in-crowd baby!!

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I'm not famous enough either

Me neither, stupid sounding names are omitted I guess.

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It does make you wonder the criteria they used to create the names. You're a big stakeholder who posts a lot. I'd have thought you'd have been ripe for cloning!

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where do I make a delegation to help stop these guys?

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Most of these are now zeroed :)

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Been working to get the votes removed at the source so they are aware of this issue before actually downvoting.

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Been working to get the votes removed at the source

I won't ask how you're going to manage that, how about new accounts?

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I built something that monitors for them and their rewards.

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Thank you for the information and your great work on the chain.
The account @br0xi is not mine.
Would it be possible to blacklist or block such accounts so that they are not even visible on the frontends?

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The #irredeemables list on Github does exactly that - but only to enemies of Bernie.

So far, that is it's only use AFAIK.

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Lol your ignorance is world class

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(Edited)

So, other than @fulltimegeek and @joe.public, what other valiant defense of the blockchain has the #irredeemables list been used for? I may be nescient, but am open to learnin'.

I recall the inception of the #irredeemables list was your doing. You sent a 60 Steem refund due @fulltimegeek to @null and sent him a pic. A disagreement ensued between @fulltimegeek and @berniesanders that ended when @fulltimegeek was completely censored by the #irredeemables list.

I note that his account, at least, is no longer on that list, but he refrains from discussing that event. Perhaps you could shed some light on how that appeal was approved.

You might also share what crimes @joe.public committed that were so dire he has to be completely censored on Hive. I suspect he just annoyed you and Bernie, and that's all it takes.

I'm surprised I'm not on the list yet.

I'm certain your finger is poised to drop the hammer right now.

I strongly advise you offer the Hive community the ability to vote on HPS proposals to approve or deny such a terrible fate as to be completely censored, before that power degrades your morals.

You may prefer not being responsible when you consider what that power wielded by you alone might cause to innocent folks if used improperly - as you have by placing @joe.public on the #irredeemables list, or keeping him on it when you have the power to remove him from it.

That list is anathema to censorship resistance, decentralization, truth, justice, and the American way, and you alone presently bear responsibility for that foul device.

It's like being boss of the dungeon back during the Inquisition. Stop using censorship to keep people from merely saying things you don't like.

If the #irredeemables list has been used to do anything other than censor folks that annoyed you and Bernie, do tell. I haven't seen it.

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(Edited)

the list is public, you can view it. There is a guy who spans dick pics you might be interested in.

I'll add fulltimegeek was never added, only the accounts that spammed. If your theory was true he would have been added as well. He was never even on the blacklist. In fact, you would have been on it ages ago if that was true.

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So did @joe.public just spam, that's what got him on the list?

Another thing, why do these blacklists need to be so deeply embedded in the architecture?

These spams and such will make it onto the blockchain anyway, right? Why not just serve up the whole thing and let the frontend pick and choose?

Ideally then the end-user could even manage their personal blacklist.

Is it because node operators don't want to serve shady content or what?

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Bullshit NO SPAM from me
get your facts right. I was commenting on the abusive spam produced by two of berniesanders accounts iflagtrash and I forget the name of the other one.
I commented of every one of his abusive comments until he stopped.
I believe my actions had a positive impact on the whole platform because he stopped abusing people like that.

What happened after that? a few weeks of peace, then themurkymark started to flag every comment i made.
My response was to make a post about the fraudulent screenshot he altered from steemworld in order to get people to believe haiejin was taking 2% of the reward pool.
The actual figure was 0.2%
The fraudulent screenshot was posted by berniesanders.

Their actions were motivated by the desire to normalize flags, which they have done. I could explain why if you like.

Anyway, they went back and edited the offending altered screenshot taken from steemworld and replaced it with another screenshot showing 12% and a link to an apology supposedly by the guy who created the tool saying he got the math wrong.

I am censored for telling the truth. I could tell you more

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I'm not accusing you of anything.

I remember iflagtrash, that was definitely spam.

I personally am pro normalizing flags/downvotes. Just seems like the opposite of a vote to me.

"I could tell you more"

I'm listening.

@themarkymark says you libeled him or whatever. Is this just a nepotism battle or what?

It does kind of sound like collusion between bernie and him the way you and others tell it.

He seems to me curiously tight lipped about the whole thing. Maybe I'm just not looking hard enough.

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(Edited)

I know for a fact that @fulltimegeek was on that list, because I saw his account on it. I know for a fact he personally posted a copious quantity of spam, at least matched by Bernie.

I have never spammed anyone. Ever.

I am disagreeable, on that I agree.

I do not know if you simply miss-recall or if you are deliberately misstating facts, but @fulltimegeek was on that list.

Bernie, on the other hand, kept spamming for a long time after that, which is why you have @joe.public on that list now, because he responded to that spam.

Answering comments isn't spam unless the original comments are spam, and Bernie isn't on the list, so you must reckon his comments weren't spam. All the more ridiculous you consider replies to it to have been spam.

Get @joe.public off that list, or continue to reveal the danger of censorship without community control to everyone that posts on Hive.

Your censorship may be the most dangerous threat to the Hive community extant. Put that power in public control and cease being a threat of centralized censorship to this community.

It is exactly the same threat Sun Yuchen was to Steem, except his view of governance and censorship differed from yours. It's the identical threat, for different reasons.

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I know for a fact that @fulltimegeek was on that list, because I saw his account on it. I know for a fact he personally posted a copious quantity of spam, at least matched by Bernie.

Well as usual, you are full of shit. The entire blacklist is available on Github with versions, history, and is searchable.

https://github.com/themarkymark-steem/buildawhaleblacklist

He was never on the list. So quit your bullshit and go play somewhere else.

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(Edited)

That is not the #irredeemables list.

That is the list I referred to. While you should rescind your unkind comments about me due to their inaccuracy, I don't care if you do or not. Your comments are about you.

My comments reveal me. I have spoken factually and accurately regarding this issue. I have refrained from ad hominems. You have made false claims, misstated facts, and personally maligned me.

If I were you, you'd be on the list by now.

This is the harm undertaking solitary power to censor people is doing to you. I strongly urge you to stop harming yourself psychologically by keeping this power your personal fief. Do the right thing and enable a public vote on #irredeemables list inclusion.

Do it for your own safety and health, if not to protect Hive from censorship.

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He was never on that either.

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Welp, I can't prove it, and he ain't tellin'. His accounts are the entirety of the list at it's inception, save for one account of Bernie's, which means I misspoke when I said Bernie was never sanctioned.

For my mistake I apologize.

I still think @fulltimegeek account was on that list, or some other mechanism prevented his posting and commenting of which I am unaware. Your coyness with factual information at your disposal does you no credit, and strongly discounts your veracity.

Stop.Censoring.People.Because.Of.Their.Opinions.

Get @joe.public off that list. He's no spammer, and censoring him does no good to Hive. In fact, it does the opposite, and degrades strongly any claim it can make to censorship resistance, and that at your hands.

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The entire list and it's history is here

https://github.com/steemit/irredeemables

It is owned and operated by Steemit Inc.

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Yeah, I just reviewed it's initial state, as I mention above.

The URL is not the factual information of which I speak. Deeds done in darkness reveal the injustice of the doers. Let the light of public knowledge inoculate you from that threat of disgrace.

Protect Hive from secret malfeasance of bad actors by doing your job in the full light of public knowledge. If you care, if you can, you will.

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I added tons of people to that list and they were hurting people. Example

steemitdefenceleague https://stish.io/the-steemit-defence-league-is-stopping-the-top-trolls-fake-abuse-reporters-and-i-have-decided-to-help-them/

I would have added many more, I will not mention those names but abuse was rampant at steem and its the same here.

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I am aware you became involved in antispam activities some time ago, but appreciate your substantive and informative comment here.

I have come to learn, as I wrassled with this issue, that there are problems and threats that simply have no other solutions at this time, AFAIK.

I am still not convinced actually eliminating the ability of individuals to post or comment on Hive, complete censorship in actual fact, should be undertaken without a vote of stakehodlers.

I also do not think that administering that tool to protect Hive should be slavery, nor left to volunteers alone. As you mention, there is no simple way to do it, and that difficulty necessitates it should be compensated, so that folks are able to be held to account.

I remain far too uninformed on these issues yet, so if you can add more that will improve my understanding, or correct errors I make, I will continue to be grateful for your help.

Thank you.

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After being attacked for telling the truth and doing good on steem I had to find a way to curb the abusers. It seems that unless you were part of a group you would have no chance.

I only dreamed of having enough steem to make a difference. Carrots were dangled before my eyes and I chased them but they never were available. We invested more than 15k USD in steem and escaped with only a 5 k loss. SO for us the crimes here matter.

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I am sad that you have suffered that loss, and hope what you have gained from your work to keep the community maintained, and in any other ways you have benefited from the community, has more value to you and yours.

I do agree crimes matter to free people, and I myself have lost hundreds of USD in value to a scammer by being hacked on Steem. It is thanks to you and @themarkymark that far more valuable discourse and information I have been blessed by more than makes up for that trivial inconvenience.

Thank you.

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I can say that @themarkymark and I both worked together tirelessly to stop the steeemitdefenceleague. And Criminal accounts like this one https://steemit.com/utopian-io/@crokkon/removing-delegations-from-faucet-abusers-1541087281843 @naturicia had a few great post about another group stealing so much with faucet delegations. Coundn't find it

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(Edited)

I just want you to be aware of this, because I think it may matter to you. It's not enough and overdue, but I have requested opportunity to provide a more satisfactory recompense as desirable.

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I have stayed away from all computer games. Life is too short..... I must live in the now and with humans.

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"I strongly advise you offer the Hive community the ability to vote on HPS proposals to approve or deny such a terrible fate as to be completely censored, before that power degrades your morals."

I like that idea, but it seems like it might just lead to large stakeholders who vote wielding censorship instead.

"That list is anathema to censorship resistance, decentralization, truth, justice, and the American way, and you alone presently bear responsibility for that foul device."

I'm with you on censorship resistance, but I'm not sure how it's meant to effect decentralization.

Abstract truth is just as insubstantial as justice to me, and the American way only conjures contempt and scorn in my mind.

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Truth, justice, and the American way is a formulaic aphorism I associate with my youthful naivete. It's unlikely to be familiar to folks not raised here.

Anathema is the enemy of. The #irredeemables list is the enemy of decentralization by enabling centralized control of speech. It could hardly be more centralized than being limited to one individual to undertake at their sole option.

As to HPS voting on censorship, it's at least a public process, which is better than what we have now, which is done in secret, in darkness, where none know it has been done, except them it has been done to. It would require action to be taken by those with substantial stake to effect censoring, which would reduce it.

Absent sound reasons presented to support the censorship, as seem not to exist in the case of @joe.public, it is likely that those voting in support of censoring accounts would also be held to account for doing so. This would reduce it as well.

It ain't perfect, but it's DPoS we got.

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I'm familiar with the concept of anathema. Interesting that you would invoke such religious vernacular, though secularized as I presume it is intended. I'd imagine that's a consequence of your strong conviction.

I see what you're saying now about the threat to decentralization.

With me being very computer technology oriented, the first thing that comes to mind in terms of decentralization is decentralized network architecture.

I'm not so sure HPS voting would reduce instances of censorship though. It seems to me that it would open the process up to anyone who could manage to promote a proposal. If anything I would expect there to be far more pushes for censorship, since many more than just @themarkymark could get the ball rolling for whatever reason.

Still I suppose it would take longer to enact each individual proposal. While I think that might largely be beneficial for careful choice, it would give spammers and abusers until finalization of voting to continue their campaigns with full visibility and impact.

I'd also say that to some limited extent @themarkymark is held to account for these actions. I'm sure he notices the opposition's rhetoric, and it likely moves the needle in terms of public opinion to some degree. I don't know of much more than that which could be done by HPS.

That's my fiftieth of a dollar on the matter.

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" It seems to me that it would open the process up to anyone who could manage to promote a proposal."

That is fine. HPS requires successful proposals to exceed the return proposal. Unless substantial yes votes are provided, HPS proposals automatically fail. This means that such spurious or troll proposals can just be ignored until they go away.

Every abstention is a vote against HPS proposals.

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"Every abstention is a vote against HPS proposals."

Neat. That sounds like something I want.

How are the votes counted? I thought it was stake-weighted, so could you not just buy it essentially? If you can vote hard enough you could possibly get it through I mean. Unless you can't vote on your own, but you could still just delegate or transfer to an alt.

I'm going to go learn more about the mechanics of the proposal system.

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(Edited)

The votes are essentially the same as witness votes as I understand it, and therefore are indeed stake-weighted.

To be successful, an HPS proposal must get more votes, more stake weighting, than the return proposal, which has substantial weight (>20M HP IIRC). Therefore proposals that do not receive substantial weight of stake do not succeed.

What I do not understand is how to make an HPS proposal. If I did, I would make one to require an HPS proposal to add a Hive account to the #irredeemables list (or the equivalent Hive is now using, if different), and to require all the accounts on it now to be voted on the same way.

This would amount to an appeal process for users presently being totally silenced by @themarkymark and the merry censors now. If good evidence of malfeasance by those accounts exists, then folks will vote to leave them on the list.

If not, they don't belong on it.

@roadscape, @drakos, and @redbeard should join @themarkymark in presenting exactly that HPS proposal, and stop censoring people covertly. Hive needs to be censorship resistant, and presently it effects censorship just as secretly as Sun Yuchen does on Steem.

Not a good look guys, and worse yet, a slippery slope to the same shitshow Steem has become, and exactly why people come here in the first place: the utter destruction of freedom of speech on legacy centralized platforms.

How do you guys expect Hive to be any different if you do the same exact things in the same exact ways as those you want to be different from?

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The list of nearly 300 accounts here are on the irredeemable list, and I would call that a great use for it.

FTG spent a bunch of steem to upvote a post with a single link (or something like that), and themarkymark removed the vote. FTG wanted his money back, but whether he knew it or not, buildawhale had a no refund policy for people upvoting spam, and to prove it wasn't about the money, he sent it to null instead of refunding it. Then FTG went to commenting thousands of times per hour with multiple accounts, basically crippling people's ability to view some posts because the comment section would crash the page. That's why his accounts were put on the list.

I have no idea what joe.public did, and perhaps it deserves a fair shake in the court of public opinion, but from everything I've personally witnessed, the list has been used well. And the front-end devs (peakd, hive.blog, 3speak, esteem) seem to agree, as they are not required to use it, and can display any or all of it if they so choose.

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(Edited)

I was in fact uninformed as to the necessity of the list when I made that comment. I have been learnin' as I go, as is my wont, and have come to agree that the list is necessary.

However, I still don't think @joe.public belonged on it, and I am happy to read just today that he no longer is. I also want to mention here that I have, as in the comment you are replying to, severely tested @themarkymark to prove he is not intent on opinion flagging.

Despite my incivility, he has not flagged me. I am presently convinced he believes, with good evidence, at least as far as I am concerned, that he is not opinion flagging, nor abuses his censorship power.

Despite these facts, this censorship power is too severe, and too seductive, to leave in the hands of one person, or even the four that seem to have been involved at one time. That is centralization of that censorship power, and is the opposite of decentralized censorship resistance, no matter the quality of the moral fiber of the individual bearing that weight alone. The moral hazard, as I mention above, is simply too onerous a burden to bear.

It was necessary that changes be undertaken, and I have briefly glanced at things today that reveal changes have been made. I still think an HPS vote is the appropriate level of control on Hive over who gets on that list, because it is essentially the end of any ability to post or comment on Hive, the equivalent of banishment, and that for stakehodlers.

Regardless of my tendency to produce these walls of text, I appreciate your informative and substantive comment, much of which I have learned is factually correct.

Thanks.

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Despite these facts, this censorship power is too severe, and too seductive, to leave in the hands of one person, or even the four that seem to have been involved at one time. That is centralization of that censorship power, and is the opposite of decentralized censorship resistance, no matter the quality of the moral fiber of the individual bearing that weight alone. The moral hazard, as I mention above, is simply too onerous a burden to bear.

But it's not just one person involved. I can go make my own list, develop an API, and put people on there I don't like. It's up to others to either use it if they find it useful, or discard it if they see no value.

It may be one person making the list, but it's up to others running services to decide whether or not to use it, which creates accountability. As soon as it is perceived to be using for abuse, the front ends would stop using it, or maybe only grab a few names from there for their own list. It is up to the list creator to make an honest list which is valuable to the community, or else all their effort can be ignored overnight.

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(Edited)

"...I can go make my own list, develop an API..."

You are a prince among men, and I and the vast majority of ordinary meat puppets are incapable of developing an API.

While things have indeed been changed (in ways I have not yet given time to understand) if the choice is between eliminating massive onslaughts of spam and a few annoying people, or suffering that devastating spam, front ends have had little practical choice.

Might as well ask me to build a moon rocket and see the Apollo astronaut's tracks on the Moon for myself to prove the Moon landing wasn't faked.

My concern has been addressed by folks with the skills and means to address it, and other than @joe.public no longer being totally censored, I have not yet ascertained how, and whether or not what has been done exceeds my hopes, meets them, or yet leaves me concerned the community remains vulnerable to being selectively silenced without meaningful recourse. I have learned a great deal from broaching this issue with @themarkymark, and at least know now I owe him both an apology for my inaccurate statements (partly undertaken already), and thanks for enabling me to better understand, as well as doing Yoeman's duty to prevent spam from causing every user on the network to suffer.

I shall have to wrap my head around new information, and new understanding, before I can determine how to proceed. One thing I can promise is that I won't be developing an API myself, because my programming skills are limited to one course in BASIC I took in 1980 that is almost a complete blank, and formerly (prior to CSS) being able to write HTML in notepad and create websites on the fly.

I don't have the skills, and neither do most people.

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FTG spent a bunch of steem to upvote a post with a single link

So what? what posible harm could that cause?

I agree a list like that if used well could hold value to the platform, especially when we accounts with stolen identities and plagiarized material. However themarkymark has proven himself to be far to dishonest and vindictive to have anything to do with any black list.
I could give you my very real grievances with him but there seems to be little point at this stage. Snd would be utterly pointless unless you were inclined to investigate what I am saying with tools that are not available to me as you would need to go back a fair and find at least one original post made by berniesanders which has been ether deleted or edited.
I dont make shit up

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Buying votes removes the proof of brain consensus. Marky was one of the few that actually cared about the quality of posts his bot voted on, and removed votes for low effort/spam posts voted by buildawhale.

I am also under no illusions that Marky is perfect, and out of the thousands of accounts blacklisted, I'm sure there were some that weren't as worthy as others. What I do know is if I were to get blacklisted, spamming obscenities and threats wouldn't be the path I would personally choose to get the matter resolved (not saying you did this, but I've seen it happen over and over). Reasonable people are more likely to be met with reason, and emotional people are more likely to be met with more emotion.

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(Edited)

Reasonable people are more likely to be met with reason

That would be nice but that does not fly when dealing with the themarkymark berniesander duo or ether of them individually, and i am sure you already understand that. They need to be rained in before hive starts to experience the decline that went on at Steem.

The act of burning a persons Steem rather than give a refund is a really shit thing to do. Only psychopath refuses to give refunds.

And who are they to judge the quality of posts have you ever looked at beniesanders posts or sat through one of themarkymarks monologue?

No these guys must not be allowed to have anything to with black listing anyone

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Whose steem got burned?

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Full time geeks
I just finised editing my little rant lol
Its good to get things off your chest sometimes. I feel better already : )

It would be really helpful if they could recognize that just because they have a high level of intelligence in certain areas, it does not imply that they have any intelligence at all with regard to what is helpful to grow the popularity of any platform, or what content holds value for people, or how much of a pay out posts should receive.

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FTG's steem didn't get burned. He sent it for a vote, and the vote was given, then taken away because it didn't meet the standards for buildawhale. However, the voting power he paid for couldn't be magically returned, since it was used for a post, so technically it was Marky's to burn.

I will say that the ToS of buildawhale could have been better, such as making users agree to the terms before they could ever use the bot, but the fact of the matter is those were the longstanding rules of the bot, and like it or not it's how it was applied to everyone, not just FTG.

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He sent it for a vote, and the vote was given, then taken away because it didn't meet the standards for buildawhale.

First up @buildawhale does not have any standards. just explore the content of their fictional posts! look into the accounts named.
No legitimate business ever refuses to provide a refund when what has been paid for is not delivered or faulty.
I have seen multiple people say, the Steem paid was burned rather that given back.

Give me an example of a real world business that is able to refuse giving a refund?
The reason is because such practices have been deemed unethical.
Blocktrades does the same thing with delegations, that is unethical as well.
That behavior only exists in the realms of criminality and thuggery.

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I have finally been cloned. Have to admit that I've been waiting for this day for a long time. Never knew that it would happen in April 2020 but we're living in weird times right now anyways.

Thanks for pointing this out.

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Great work! Thanks. I'm glad you're one of our witnesses here on Hive.

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Thanks for this list keep up the good work 🤝

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Those guys and their buffoonery. They just don’t know when to stop. It’s ridiculous already. Steem is garbage.

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You're doing great work to keep our chain clean thanks

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Wow that is a long list. And what sucks is that those usernames are gone forever, no?

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  • Wow that is a long list.

That's what she said.

image.png

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(Edited)

Thats only 300 accounts added on a 74K+ list! Literally 0.5%. Conversely, my DTube blacklist is only 6 users! More info in my latest blog ;)

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Hahah I feel so honored to be someone that these people want to mimic! Sad to see my bro @chekohler not up on that list! :(

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LOL clearly I fly well under the radar! Gosh really who has time for this? Seems like a lot of effort that could have been put to better use

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Dude it's crazy, they even copied my profile picture as well as my other account info! I'm not sure if I'm creeped out or excited to have an online stalker.

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Lol damn son I better be carful around you and double check your posts and comments could be talking to your doppelgänger

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LOL Need a code word for verification purposes.

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I remember back on Steem, @berniesanders created an account used to mock @lindsaybowes that I did not notice was not them for three days. I was fooled by the @lindsayblowes use of their avatar and etc.

This appears to be that exact same tactic. Makes you think...

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Did it steal her posts? No.

These are more than parody accounts.

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So was that. I was alarmed at the vicious and baseless remarks issuing from what I thought was a civilized person. Turns out those remarks were not coming from that source at all.

Live and learn.

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Sometimes it is true that we have to take a closer look to identify and understand that it is a fake user. Thanks for your efforts.

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I am in this list, sort of, the account has a DASH in the middle of my user name that doesn't show on the Spam profile.
There are two of my shares showing there.

What can I do? Would it help if I commented that it is a SPAM account?
Please let me know what I should or can do about this before it gets out of hand @themarkymark, and thanks for bringing this to my attention

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Hey @themarkymark thanks for spotting this and going over the issue, it’s really concerning... thx for notifying us, we will be spreading the word out 😉

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I wonder how they are picking accounts to impersonate.

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OMG! Some of the names remind me of those fake designer perfumes from back in the day

😅

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Doesn't look like they have tried to imitate me yet. I would hope that their rep can be knocked down so they are more obviously fake. Who is giving them big votes?

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I am definitely too small to be impersonated ! I feel safe for now haha 😆

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I saw v-lemon so you certainly have been.

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Didnt look enough. I am a superstar ! Thank you

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Thanks for your detective work on this! Such a sad way of spamming :-/

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I appreciate this valid use of your tools. This kind of spam/scammer is why downvotes are necessary on Hive.

However, @joe.public is not such a spam/scammer, and it is a strong signal that moderation of the tools you use needs to be immediately undertaken for the protection of the community from abuse by individuals applying the tools you control that he is on your blacklists, and totally censored by the #irredeemables mechanism.

Get him off that list!

Your inaction on this matter continues to indict you as potentially abusive to every user of Hive. When it is proved you are incapable of being trusted with the absolute power to censor anyone you want, I won't be around to tell you - or anyone else - I told you so.

I'll be on the list.

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Honestly, who goes round creating so many impersonator accounts, they really have too much time on their hands.

Gutted that I'm not famous enough either, though one of my community account got on the list 🙃

Thanks for doing this list @themarkymark

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This list is damn long. I hope it does not associated with some of plans of Justin to bring hive down

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This is absolutely crazy, even my profile is copied, and I have a very small account.

Let's keep a very close eye on this, could be another one of Justin's tricks to make us look bad.

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WOw that is a long list I knew my account was sone they copied but did not realise there are so many

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Nice work Bat Man!

Sneaky bastards got me... banking on the fact that 99.9% of the human population is pretty much NEVER paying attention to detail.

Appreciate the efforts on this!

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keep hunting them!

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someguy456

hahaha for some reason this is legit my favorite one x^D

Nice job on spotting this. I wonder what their genius endgame is? Just a spam on the reward pool ( which is pretty easy to take care of ), or are they really hoping to cause some long-lasting catastrophe by making a fake post from a top account?

Pathetic waste of time, shouldn't they be working on bettering Steem? ;^P

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I have identified over 300 accounts in this network and have have been additional ones created that haven't activated yet.

Wow so you're THAT good? That's some minority report shit right there bro

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That is some hard work!!! Kudos for keeping the Hive clean :)

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Phew! thank goodness I'm not in the list of Doppelgängers. Cause I'd be well pissed off if one of these impostors would copy & paste one of my posts and make more do$h than me. };)

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(Edited)

Thank you very much for informing me. It is indeed a blatant attack on HIVE.
The phantom account @felix-garciap has already been denounced.
Cheers

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Thanks for being on top of this and making us aware!

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Yes! Community working effectively against idiot attacks. Hopefully the idiots doing these realize this only empowers and puts more value onto this community...

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Dang! I got fooled for a moment by the iamjade1ine account, since I follow the real one (she's been busy with her family & hasn't posted lately) because another friend reblogged the fake post. After I realized my mistake and removed my upvote, I realized other friends might see my share and do the same. Ugh, fucking scammers. Thanks for catching this & shouting out!

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Wow.

My reaction is basically to not vote on stuff from created for a while.

I don't want to feed the spam network.

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Thank you for putting all this together and for the warning!

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Damn. That sucks.
Thanks for sharing and rehived.

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That's what downvotes are made for :)

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(Edited)

Already done, but people are getting confused which are real and which are not. Especially when they don't even know this is going on. That and no one really uses downvotes.

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Thank you for letting us know... I am being copied.. Don't like scammers.

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My account (the false one) is in the list... It was a big surprise to find a fake me posting on my community yesterday !

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I am not a technical person who understand this all etc.
But after Steem Hive case. I understand that it is not easy to Manage all these things.
HATS OFF to You and all people working for the Platform betterment.

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Thank you for keeping tabs on this and for all you do to prevent/reduce it.

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looks like a bullionstacker deal to me

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Classic scammers. Easy to spot if you know what your looking for and always questioning. Although many new users could get caught out. Agreed always good to look at rep level. Wonder what the spam level will be like when Hive is worth more than a few cents... ill be ready!

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(Edited)

Oh! My God!
They used my name and Photo also :O
Thanks for the great Information.

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Thanks for ongoing work at keeping Hive clean of these idiots....

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Thank you @themarkymark for all the work that you do. Can't thank you enough. It is upsetting to see that my account was not spared but I am glad this was made known. What is wrong with these people who take pleasure in doing crap like this?

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That's such a scum. Thank you for taking care of this! The fake account (kristyg1as) was spamming random posts in my name and my friend @marblely (fake: marble-ly) is also on the list :S
Once again, thank you so much for removing him!! I'm even more glad now that I came back :)

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ok, retin0x is already listed... Just have noticed it 2 days ago...
Anything I can do except using my downvotes?

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Thanks a lot, @themarkymark!
I just found out, kudos to your post, that my account has been "cloned". How do I fight this? Photos had been stolen many times from me before but this is really impudent!

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Not much you can do as a user, but they are blacklisted and will not show up on the site.

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Thank you, this sounds quite discouraging...

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